By diehard Go To PostWell there's these things called DUI's…
People drive whilst using their phones too. Absolute breh behaviour.
alcohol and cars aren't made exclusively for killing people. yeah, i get the whole 'but hunting' thing - but if you hunt with a tricked out ar-15 you're a clown
also lol handguns
also lol handguns
By diehard Go To PostIn the case of a DUI death, the car isn't what i blame. Why are the goalposts different with alcohol? It kills 3 times as many Americans as guns but it doesn't matter because it's.. slower? It's a freedom we have that we have decided to trade lives for. Your country did it too.
Because DUI deaths would not be possible if a human was not operating approximately 4,000 pounds of weight traveling at, say, 50mph, for the purpose of traveling to a different destination. People don't often take up arms for any other purpose than to shoot something.
By DY_nasty Go To Postalcohol and cars aren't made exclusively for killing people. yeah, i get the whole 'but hunting' thing - but if you hunt with a tricked out ar-15 you're a clownI'm not comparing Cars, the "Gun deaths vs Car deaths" debate is idiotic. There's problems with comparing Alcohol to guns too, but in the specific argument of freedoms vs lives.. i believe it works.
also lol handguns
By Laboured Go To PostBecause DUI deaths would not be possible if a human was not operating approximately 4,000 pounds of weight traveling at, say, 50mph, for the purpose of traveling to a different destination. People don't often take up arms for any other purpose than to shoot something.I really don't understand your rebuttal here.
I wouldn't compare alcohol consumption to gun use because alcohol consumption to me is like a modifier to car or gun use. To me it doesn't really appropriately enter into the conversation re the base right to use either cars or guns.
By Laboured Go To PostI wouldn't compare alcohol consumption to gun use because alcohol consumption to me is like a modifier to car or gun use. To me it doesn't really appropriately enter into the conversation re the base right to use either cars or guns.So you completely absolve the legalization of alcohol in any DUI related death?
By FortuneFaded Go To PostWhy shouldn't Americans have the freedom to mount guns on the front of their cars?why wouldn't americans have the freedom to have the same amount of security for schools that a shopping mall has
By Laboured Go To PostNaw, man, I know that, I'm saying it's about time they put up or shut up cus they're the problem. Take out an F-22 cluster bombing your house with your fucking AR-15 or frankly fuck off.
By diehard Go To PostWhat the fuck are you even talking about? These people will absolutely put-up. Now your advocating not only a repeal of an amendment but a military strike on civilians? I can't deal with this without using insulting words.
That's not what his post said. Gun owners like to convince themselves that one of the reasons they own guns is to topple a tyrannical government. His post was making the point that the government has better weapons than you. See: Jim Jefferies
Perhaps it was clumsily worded, but that was the point.
If I'm wrong, he can correct me.
That's a totally different issue. Any gun owner thinking that (in a vacuum) civilians fighting a modern military to any effect is a moron. But an armed populace can be a deterrence to tyranny. I can go into this more but it's not the discussion now (unless you want it to be) and i'm trying to watch basketball :/
By Randolph Freelander Go To PostThat's not what his post said. Gun owners like to convince themselves that one of the reasons they own guns is to topple a tyrannical government. His post was making the point that the government has better weapons than you. See: Jim Jefferiesehhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh i wouldn't say 'topple' exactly. and honestly if you'd really make an attempt at breaking down what a defended citizen or group of citizens means than its a pretty significant symbol in every patch of american history you can find.
Perhaps it was clumsily worded, but that was the point.
If I'm wrong, he can correct me.
and if the military/police wanted to mow down every citizen with a gun, they could - and that kinda goes back to my previous larger point about the 2nd amendment repeal as a whole. is it worth it?
its especially because those sorts of ordeals losing their worth is also how many, many wars end in a withdrawal or defeat. it wouldn't be worth it is why a respect is assured in broader senses. again, the irony and hypocrisy needs to emphasized. if you've ever felt that cops have overstepped their limits before, then its incredibly odd that you're suddenly pro-disarmament of citizens as an american in particular. its disingenuous or just plain lazy to pick and choose when you want to have rights and liberties defended but get picky and weird regarding how.
i've also stated before in regards to the whole BLM/Black Panther arguments from waaaaaaaaaaay back. an armed community literally effectively checks a police body and forces communication on the grounds that its 'not worth it'*
*as an american, very very very very very different overseas for a ton of reasons. they put up with shit your average american would never tolerate in a hundred years lol
By diehard Go To PostThat's a totally different issue. Any gun owner thinking that (in a vacuum) civilians fighting a modern military to any effect is a moron. But an armed populace can be a deterrence to tyranny. I can go into this more but it's not the discussion now (unless you want it to be) and i'm trying to watch basketball :/
Many, if not most, gun owners are perfectly fine with a tyrannical government. For example, the NRA could positively not give a shit when police kill unarmed black people (or lawfully armed black people, as the facts have it). 2nd Amendment loving conservative voters? Same. They're all about some tyranny. They just love it. As long as it's directed towards other people.
Anyway. Fuck the second amendment. Back to other endeavors.
When has the NRA ever clapped back at the police for anything?
Most would call me a 2nd Amendment loving American (not really a conservative voter though) and i'll be right there with everyone else saying fuck the police.
Most would call me a 2nd Amendment loving American (not really a conservative voter though) and i'll be right there with everyone else saying fuck the police.
its always been about brown people getting fucked
the only time the 2nd amendment even came remotely close to seeing a repeal is when brown people circled their wagons
so im staying consistent lol
the only time the 2nd amendment even came remotely close to seeing a repeal is when brown people circled their wagons
so im staying consistent lol
By DY_nasty Go To Postits always been about brown people getting fucked
the only time the 2nd amendment even came remotely close to seeing a repeal is when brown people circled their wagons
so im staying consistent lol
Yeah, a white person walks around with a powerful rifle strapped to his back? He's a patriot, displaying his second amendment freedom. A black man does the same thing? Oh god, he's a gangster, a thug. Kill him.
Let a black man grill out in the park? Shiiiiiiit...
well, i mean even historically long before these ~polarizing times~ that have ~never been worse~ its easier to hassle and shoot a singled up unarmed black person than it is to address a community or large group of armed individuals that want to see due process executed according to the letter
that's a hell of a lot better than handing over my means to protect myself when the cops won't show up to my neighborhood when i call 911 in the first place, voting to give them more invasive privileges and the reduction of my own rights, and tweeting aggressively from starbucks before i'm asked to leave OR rioting then promptly forgetting who the hell is even running for office just a few months later
its not like they could tulsa us again
maybe
that's a hell of a lot better than handing over my means to protect myself when the cops won't show up to my neighborhood when i call 911 in the first place, voting to give them more invasive privileges and the reduction of my own rights, and tweeting aggressively from starbucks before i'm asked to leave OR rioting then promptly forgetting who the hell is even running for office just a few months later
its not like they could tulsa us again
maybe
I hate guns but a wholesale ban isn't dealing with a lot of American mentality and general bullshit, especially the violence, plenty of DV doesn't even involve guns.
By Random Ass Username Go To PostI hate guns but a wholesale ban isn't dealing with a lot of American mentality and general bullshit, especially the violence, plenty of DV doesn't even involve guns.
Surely the govt can do a lot more to try and change this. Kinda like with cigarettes. You can sell them, but well do our best to educate against them.
Poor Horse doesn't really have firm understanding of American culture. Personal freedoms is tantamount to literally God and an intrinsic feature of American culture. That's why a large majority only care about what they think and not about how it affects others.
Odd how so many Americans don’t understand the contradiction between freedom to have guns but not abortions or taking knees at football games.
Funny how all these guns couldn't make America great again before Trump could.
And on another serious note: Old people and minorities were first and foremost the willingest victims of con artists like New York (and Maryland) bankers, right?
And on another serious note: Old people and minorities were first and foremost the willingest victims of con artists like New York (and Maryland) bankers, right?
I’ve changed my views. I realize I’m fighting a losing battle so I’m gonna change my stance. Let all murder with a gun be legal, it is our god given right after all
Real life should be like GTA where we can speed up and shoot the asshole that cuts us off and almost causes an accident.
Guns aren’t the problem so why limit what I can do with them?
Real life should be like GTA where we can speed up and shoot the asshole that cuts us off and almost causes an accident.
Guns aren’t the problem so why limit what I can do with them?
By Smoke Dogg Go To PostFunny how all these guns couldn't make America great again before Trump could.i wouldn't say willing at all. i mean shit, you've got black money getting killed in the streets and people openly, proudly screwing over any african american looking for a loan even now - all that's left to get a step is the democ
And on another serious note: Old people and minorities were first and foremost the willingest victims of con artists like New York (and Maryland) bankers, right?
oh. nice one
By RobNBanks Go To PostI’ve changed my views. I realize I’m fighting a losing battle so I’m gonna change my stance. Let all murder with a gun be legal, it is our god given right after alllol aite
Real life should be like GTA where we can speed up and shoot the asshole that cuts us off and almost causes an accident.
Guns aren’t the problem so why limit what I can do with them?
fingers in the ears and ban all guns but no care at all to how it happens in even the most boiled down state. how would you do it - like seriously, i'm curious. federal level gun ban and 2nd amendment gone. what do you want to see happen. priorities. powers enabled to ensure its executed appropriately.
and i'll give a completely non bias, to the point, open concern of mine in return
for the sake of argument lets not just throw radicals around
By diehard Go To PostPeople will die to keep guns. It would be like a straight up attack on their very principals. Why is this so hard to understand?I can't believe this is a defense.
By RobNBanks Go To PostI’m not even joking that’s my new stance. Fuck it. Why should cops get to have all the funsure. i'll work with this. why the fuck not.... geez
cops not having all the fun is kinda my thing - and the best way historically for a single or small group of brown people to not get the hassle/beat down/shooting/coke sprinkle combo is to be in large groups, well-informed, and armed. this instead of having a cell phone clip that won't even get a cop fired when it shows that the entire precinct tampered with a body camera that we worked oh so hard for them to pay for (with our money) and (not regularly) use. or rioting for a seat at the table in the kiddie chair when we just get shot in said riots anyways and ignored even if we get to the table.
By FlutterPuffs Go To PostI can't believe this is a defense.it is because you guys flatly don't understand the scale of the issue. a lot of the disarmaments in europe came at a time when there was an easy to identify bitterness from a fuckton of war and people were fed up enough, and tired enough, to see something like that through. its the complete opposite here. there's places that are damn near completely self sufficient and they are explicitly because they've never had the best of terms with the federal or state government for generations lol
then you've got the classic gun nuts who've waited for the day to open the arsenal up
then you've got the people who are armed and will, absolutely will, be killed in crossfires with our world renowned antagonistic and conflict escalating police force even though they haven't done shit
we just saw our feds sick dogs and spray water on peaceful protesters camping out a pipeline daring them to shoot back while there were full on convoys of shit we didn't even break out on Iraqis.
so yeah, even in the lightest and most hopeful realistic terms - it can be referred to as a defense if you'd really apply something like that to a national level. and that's wishful thinking tbh.
The best way we can handle guns is to make them like cars and parse out the responsible owners from the shitheads and then eventually phase out the culture. A wholesale ban would just incite the fuck outta militia bros. It's one of the few times I'll endorse incrementalism because the fix it now "solutions" people keep tossing around are not taking into account a lot of shit.
By Random Ass Username Go To PostThe best way we can handle guns is to make them like cars and parse out the responsible owners from the shitheads and then eventually phase out the culture .
Agreed.
Also I'd really rather us focus on demilitarizing (and god forbid actually training) our police before we tackle the issue of guns amongst the civilian population.
By Random Ass Username Go To PostAlso I'd really rather us focus on demilitarizing (and god forbid actually training) our police before we tackle the issue of guns amongst the civilian population.l've never been that much of a fan of felony murder, but broadening that as well would be huge
Yeah some actual criminal liability for the ease of access to a gun is something that should be pushed right now. Start actually seeing gun safes and shit. And it would deal with the amount of toddlers blowing their own heads off, something people don't really talk about, it's all about shooting up schools.
By Random Ass Username Go To PostYeah some actual criminal liability for the ease of access to a gun is something that should be pushed right now. Start actually seeing gun safes and shit. And it would deal with the amount of toddlers blowing their own heads off, something people don't really talk about, it's all about shooting up schools.the general theme for many of those cases isn't negligence either. its "those parents have suffered enough" ironically
it'd be wildly unpopular and perceived as unsympathetic but i'd love to see it sprouting up at state levels. felony murder in general is misused like crazy (lol throwing the book at black people), but another form of it stretching towards legal guardians/caretakers would be nice to see. if no one is gonna actually put pressure on anything else practical, there's definitely a place for something like that and it flows within everything already at work
Most gun manufactures now include trigger locks with new guns, making it a federal law would be good.
By DY_nasty Go To Postthe general theme for many of those cases isn't negligence either. its "those parents have suffered enough" ironicallyI loathe that "they already lost their kid" shit. Their utter negligence about a weapon helped kill a person. A kid isn't a fucking pet. They're a human being too.
it'd be wildly unpopular and perceived as unsympathetic but i'd love to see it sprouting up at state levels. felony murder in general is misused like crazy (lol throwing the book at black people), but another form of it stretching towards legal guardians/caretakers would be nice to see. if no one is gonna actually put pressure on anything else practical, there's definitely a place for something like that and it flows within everything already at work
By Random Ass Username Go To PostI loathe that "they already lost their kid" shit. Their utter negligence about a weapon helped kill a person. A kid isn't a fucking pet. They're a human being too.Laws only work as a preventative measure, no idiot is going to think "you know, having my kid kill somebody doesn't concern me but possible jail time will.. i better lock this up". I mean, i guess if you are all about using prison as a punishment that's another thing.
Negligent homicide seems entirely reasonable to me.
If your gun is used to hurt or kill another person and it was not in self-defense, then it's unjustified and you go to jail. Ain't no such thing as an accident. The gun is weapon of death, it is your responsibility to ensure it doesn't kill anyone without cause. No excuses.
Edit: Actually, in seeing some of the maximum sentences for negligent homicide, perhaps that isn't strong enough. Lot of short maximums out there. 2 years in Texas, for example. Other states range up to 10 years.
I guess they're not quite so pro-life in Texas after all.
https://criminal-law.freeadvice.com/criminal-law/violent_crimes/negligent-homicide.htm
If your gun is used to hurt or kill another person and it was not in self-defense, then it's unjustified and you go to jail. Ain't no such thing as an accident. The gun is weapon of death, it is your responsibility to ensure it doesn't kill anyone without cause. No excuses.
Edit: Actually, in seeing some of the maximum sentences for negligent homicide, perhaps that isn't strong enough. Lot of short maximums out there. 2 years in Texas, for example. Other states range up to 10 years.
I guess they're not quite so pro-life in Texas after all.
Punishment for a Negligent Homicide Conviction
Even though it is the lowest category of homicide offenses, negligent homicide is still a serious offense. Punishment can range from probation to time in a penitentiary. In Alaska, the maximum penitentiary time is 10 years. In Texas, the punishment for negligent homicide ranges from 180 days up to 2 years in prison, with no possibility of parole. Overall, punishment in most states ranges from six months to 10 years for a negligent homicide conviction. Because criminal negligence is similar to general negligence, a defendant could also face an independent civil lawsuit for causing the death of another person.
https://criminal-law.freeadvice.com/criminal-law/violent_crimes/negligent-homicide.htm
By Random Ass Username Go To PostI loathe that "they already lost their kid" shit. Their utter negligence about a weapon helped kill a person. A kid isn't a fucking pet. They're a human being too."those poor parents" those poor kids smh
i'll never be fully behind the idea because its inherently riding on the premise that you prove innocence more than you prove guilt.... but its something that'd absolutely curve a ton of shit
By diehard Go To PostLaws only work as a preventative measure, no idiot is going to think "you know, having my kid kill somebody doesn't concern me but possible jail time will.. i better lock this up". I mean, i guess if you are all about using prison as a punishment that's another thing.it curved getaway drivers and burglaries hard af.... even to this day, seasoned robbers and career criminals, people who look at jail time like its an inevitability, will go out of their way to not hit occupied homes or do so with weapons
the first few cases of crying shitty moms on the news would do work. i'll take your own example of DUIs - seeing drunk drivers crying in the court room for killing their friends and being made liable had a definite effect
Criminal liability actually does start to have an effect on how people go about things. People are much more considerate about who they loan a car out to because of the potential of the drivers impairment or idiocy coming down on their head too. This isn't a bad thing.
It was amazing how some people would still loan their car out to me even though they knew I was going through bipolar issues.
The poll suggests that the margin of victory for the Yes side in the referendum will be 68 per cent to 32 per cent – a stunning victory for the Yes side after a long and often divisive campaign.
More than 4,500 voters were interviewed by Ipsos/MRBI as they left polling stations on Friday. Sampling began at 7am and was conducted at 160 locations across every constituency throughout the day. The margin of error is estimated at +/- 1.5 per cent.
Counting of votes begins on Saturday morning at 9am with an official result expected to be declared in the afternoon.
However, the size of the victory predicted by the exit poll leaves little doubt that, whatever the final count figures, the constitutional ban on abortion, inserted in a referendum in 1983, is set to be repealed.
[...]
The poll also finds that women voted in favour of the proposal by a massive margin, with 70 per cent voting in favour and 30 per cent voting against. Support amongst men was weaker, though still convincing, at 65 per cent to 35 per cent.
As expected, younger voters were overwhelmingly in favour of the change, with whopping majorities in all age groups under 65. Those over 65 voted against the proposed change, the poll finds.
Among the youngest voters, support for the change was overwhelming – the poll finds that 87 per cent of those aged between 18-24 voted for repeal.
Good to hear and hopefully we don't get an upset. For anyone wondering why this and same-sex marriage went to a public referendum, it has to do with the Irish constitution. Irish Law says that any amendments made to the constitution require a referendum and since abortion and marriage were in the Irish constitution there needed to be a referendum.
Malcom X, Cassius Clay/Muhammad Ali, and MLK, Jr. were the three greatest dudes ever.
They, are whose portraits I would hang in the offices of my unions-supported company.
They, are whose portraits I would hang in the offices of my unions-supported company.